84 – The Challenges of Communications

In today’s episode, Peter and Sonny start a series of three episodes about communications. What happens when they go right, when they go wrong, when there’s a lack of leadership, etc. Most problems will boil down to communication.

We also share our very first podcast award. We were the winners of  “The Shandy”, given out by the ABC Chapter’s Presidents’ Executive Committee. 

The full audiovisual version of this episode is available on YouTube: https://youtu.be/KIHv2MeX934 

“The Obvious Podcast” is a production of ABC Florida East Coast Chapter. Unless otherwise stated, all content reflects the opinions of the guests and hosts.

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Transcript

Sonny Maken 0:10

All right. Welcome to the Obvious Podcast. This is episode number 84. My name is Sonny Maken.

Peter Dyga 0:18

And I'm Peter Dyga, president and CEO at the ABC Florida East Coast.

Sonny Maken 0:22

You are watching us or listening to the Obvious Podcast, where all opinions expressed are our own, unless we say otherwise.

Peter Dyga 0:30

Love the show. We ask you to subscribe on any major podcast platform or watch us in action on YouTube. Follow the Obvious Podcast on Instagram, X, and True Social, and now on TikTok. All the links you need are in the show notes. Reach out to us anytime at the Obvious at abceflorida.com. And if you're enjoying the ride, help others find us by leaving a review wherever you listen. Happy Friday, son.

Sonny Maken 0:55

Happy Friday, Peter. Hope you had a nice Easter week. I did. Easter Sunday, right? Yeah. And everything everything is going really well. By the way, did you know as I was reading this about um our show, it's available on YouTube with or without video? I found that out this weekend.

Peter Dyga 1:13

Yes, I found it a couple weekends ago when I linked uh clicked on the wrong one and the video. So yeah.

Sonny Maken 1:19

So if you're looking for the video and it's not playing, there's another link there. And it's usually they're right next to each other, so you will find them.

Peter Dyga 1:24

So I wanted to talk, Sonny, about we received our first award at the podcast. Excellent. At the ABC National Convention. It's called uh Shandy. So shout out to Shandon, uh chapter president out of San Diego. So she's the current uh chapter president's liaison on the ABC National Executive Committee and head of the ABC, head of the uh ABC Chapter President's Executive Committee. So, any event, our first award, a Shandy Award. Congratulations. Which uh took quite a bit of work from what I understand. It's uh kind of very unique. There's uh only 20 others like them. Approximately 20 others that she gave away to for different other reasons at the convention. So anyway, our first award as a podcast. Excellent pretty cool. Yep.

Sonny Maken 2:07

So very exciting. I wanted to talk to you about in the um Catholic Church, when you have the uh I know you don't you don't call it a message, the Sunday homily. Uh do those tend to be related at all, or is there like a pattern, or will a will a priest come up and say, you know, for the next five weeks we're gonna talk about the Pauline epistles or something like that, or is it different every Sunday? I guess do you understand my question?

Peter Dyga 2:36

Yeah, I don't know. I'm not sure. So I mean, um there's there's uh th there's obviously very structured uh to the to the readings at every Sunday Mass. There's always an Old Testament reading, an epistle reading, and then a gospel reading. Uh the church very carefully, by the way, over the course of three years, pretty much the whole Bible is is uh is is preached and read at uh at Sunday Mass. Um and they're all very related. In fact, I've always found since I had my re-conversion, if you will, you know, because we we talked in other people, you know, about falling away, you know, in your eighteen teens and your twenties and coming back and whatnot. Um I I find it uh fascinating to try to figure out how all the readings are connected. Because the church is for some reason ties in together. They're there for a reason together, and they're you know, sometimes it's obvious, sometimes it's not so obvious. And then there are some periods where uh, you know, like Lent or Easter or you know, the different liturgical seasons where the readings for a number of weeks or for a period will be related. So the reason I'm asking, so in our in the in the the homilies are supposed to be now you always have rogue rogue priests, yeah, unfortunately, but you know, they're instructed that you know it's supposed to be a homily on the readings and tying all the readings together and what the what the teachings got it.

Sonny Maken 3:57

So um in the churches that I've attended, you know, and again, setting aside the liturgical times, the pastor will come up and he'll say, you know, we're starting a new series on and sometimes you know, sort of the new agey churches will get into themes. Um but the churches that I have attended usually tend to get into, say, the writings. So we're gonna cover the book of Corinthians for the next four weeks, or we're gonna cover this, right? So the reason I'm bringing this up is I think our next few How are you bringing this up? I'll get to it. Our next few episodes uh are gonna have a theme. And the theme of our next few episodes will be communications. Communication.

Peter Dyga 4:39

Yeah, okay.

Sonny Maken 4:40

And how important that is, and what happens when it falls apart, and how it's connected, and how it's related, and how it matters in leadership, how it matters at at certainly at ABC and everything that we do as executives.

Peter Dyga 4:53

So have you heard me say, because I've I've said it often, uh it's uh something I feel like I've learned through life, which is uh pretty much every problem boils down to communication. Yeah. Have you ever heard me say that? Yeah. You know, it just really that's you know, it's uh you know, a lack of or miscommunication or something, you know, whether it's world wars or uh minor office politics. I mean you could I I honestly believe most issues boil down to communication. Absolutely. That's why we want to talk about it. All right.

Sonny Maken 5:23

And I know that the the issues we're gonna talk about in the next few episodes will all sort of have that as the underlying theme and and and we're kind of laying it out for you because when you go through it and you and if you especially if you're listening to the episode sequentially, you'll kind of see uh the point that we're trying to make. And the whole point of having a podcast is so that we're able to communicate, right? That's the whole idea behind it, uh whether it's whatever whatever it is we're trying to communicate, that's sort of the underlying need to even have a show in the first place.

Peter Dyga 5:50

Right. And so And we've alluded to many times that uh if people aren't hearing you, yeah, then it's difficult to communicate. Yeah. Then it's it's you know, so if you had a you know a a boring podcast, um there would really be no value or little value in trying to communicate at all through the podcast, right? So you first of all got to have people's attention and have them listening. Exactly. I remember Mr.

Sonny Maken 6:15

Producer telling us that most By the way, the contest continues, so if you want to send us an email as to why Peter's ringing the bell.

Peter Dyga 6:25

Yeah, pretty much any show. Yeah, if you're the first email after that show is uh live. Is that what the how you refer to it, you know, uh aired? If you're the first email, you'll have to trust us on that one. So we're happy to give you some kind of gift.

Sonny Maken 6:39

Well we've had some winners, we've had a couple of winners, and uh we've given some gifts away. So uh but I remember Mr. Producer telling us when we hit um was it nine episodes, ten episodes, that it was like we were we were already in like rarefied air because most people never go has three, right? Hard to believe. Three or five. Most people just kind of stop because you know it's nobody's listening, nobody's watching, and they lose interest or they lose hope and they go on. And we're at episode 84, this is right. Well, I can't believe 84. Like I never thought we would be talking about 84 episodes. So I mean it's amazing. And and it's all thanks to our audience. Anyway, so communication. And the thing that you know it's been in the news this this past week uh that we've all kind of talked about in the past couple of weeks is the the pilots getting rescued in Iran. And I, you know, I've been thinking about communication a lot over the last few few months, actually, and how I've always kind of prided myself. I always thought I was a great communicator, right? You know, of one you know in school, like you know, debating things and things like that. I I've done well on papers, I've done well academically. And so like public speaking isn't an issue for me. And so I always thought, oh, I'm a great communicator. And you know, throughout my life, people are like, oh man, you're so blunt and you're so uh straightforward, which is fine. Like I don't have a problem with that. Because, you know, in my mind, as the title of this episode, you know, clarity creates kindness. Because I think if you're clear with people, it really uh makes life a lot easier.

Peter Dyga 8:11

And I tend to, you know, I mean I tend to agree with that, right? You know, except I mean I think that's kind of the nuance of that's the nuance of the show or the series, you know, is that people, all sorts of people communicate differently. Exactly. You know, and some people, with that kind of clarity, like like for example, you might make the argument that our current president kind of falls in that category. You know, he's very blunt. Some people think he's too too direct, um crude even, you know, which maybe all those things are true, uh, but that communication style is problematic for some people. And they want more nuanced. Not only is it problematic, it's in order to receive it.

Sonny Maken 8:49

It's it's the actions are subservient to the style. What do you mean by that? Like the fact that it doesn't matter what his policies are, it doesn't matter the end result of his policies, because his communication style is so abrasive and blunt and all of that, that's that's where they stop.

Peter Dyga 9:06

Yeah.

Sonny Maken 9:07

And you're good. Right? Right? Okay. It's that's all right. That's so part of my trigger for this episode, I was I watched this reel on um Instagram.

Peter Dyga 9:19

Uh-huh.

Sonny Maken 9:20

It was a long reel. And it was a capture of Donald Trump's interviews over the last 35 years. Okay. Right? Different different shows. On a given topic? Any topic. It was just showing Yeah, just clips of him. Okay. On from different interviews going back to the 80s. Okay. And there he is in the 80s, talking about is your argument, you know, the style is very similar, or what's the style is very similar and and the content's very similar, right? So he's talking about uh tariffs back in the 80s. He's talking about China back in the 80s.

Peter Dyga 9:54

Yeah.

Sonny Maken 9:54

He's talking about Iran back in the 80s. He's, you know. And so my my point of that was like, the man hasn't changed, right? So this whole idea that somehow he's sort of a hostage to world leaders or whatever, right? Like, I mean, you just listen to that.

Peter Dyga 10:09

Yeah. And you're like, if you just look at that whole approach, so simpleton.

Sonny Maken 10:14

Right.

Peter Dyga 10:14

So it but it also's style, though. Right.

Sonny Maken 10:18

But going back to our point about communication, like it blows my mind that we don't have people who can't see past that, like who can't see the results. Right? Right. And they're upset about the way he he tweets or the way he he communicates. And what do you do in a situation like that? Like, what would you do? Would you change your communication style? Would you would you try to adapt it? Would you just be like, I gotta f like obviously for somebody like the president, his his audience is the whole country. It's liberals, it's it's conservatives, it's middle of the road people. He can't really uh craft a message. But those of us who aren't in such a sort of widely recognized position, you know, we have the ability to sort of craft our messaging and our communication style. How do you how do you tackle that?

Peter Dyga 11:08

I mean, you have a lot of resources, obviously, you know, in terms of the press office and you know, and then the other thing that's unfortunate in my book, we've talked I gotta stop saying that, you know, because at episode 84, there's probably very little we haven't talked about in some way or or another. But um it's unfortunate that you know, most people you can rely on the press to do their digging and to be fair-minded about it. Wow. And to and to present a case in a different way. Or at least this is the dream. This is the this is the expectation, I think, for most Americans. Well, maybe not anymore. I don't know. You know, but that should be the press we have. That should be the you know, and and and by the way, they talk about communication. Well, there's your opportunity to communicate that. If you could actually rely instead of on a partisan press, yeah, you know, on a press that actually uh took a particular issue and then delved into it and talked about the different aspects of it, that would be a different way of communicating. I mean, but you can't even rely on that anymore.

Sonny Maken 12:05

You can't. I mean, you and I have done multiple episodes on how you can't hate the media enough. So I think that's and if you were gonna if you were gonna look at us as a as somebody making a case in a court of law, I think we've done a spectacular job of showing you how dishonest the media is. And therefore, their messaging can't be trusted, right? So the onus to do your own evidence and your own research falls upon you. But what I wanted to talk about was a pilot's issue, right? So you are talking about a guy who's lost in a hostile country, you know, um, a country that we are bombing. You're talking about a guy who's injured. That's what a lot of people said that when he you when you eject, there's such an incredible G-force. And then you're talking about all these people sort of in a in a you know, lack of a better term, a bureaucratic environment trying to find him and rescue him. And if there's any miscommunication in that, I mean it happens, right? Friendly fire happens, there's miscommunication that happens in even in a military settings. But if there's any miscommunication in rescuing this guy, either his rescue gets delayed or it doesn't happen. Right. And so you could argue that in some way the military has solved that problem, although certainly not to 100%, because and nothing ever is a hundred percent.

Peter Dyga 13:18

Yeah.

Sonny Maken 13:18

But to a large degree, I think they've solved that problem. And I and to me it's very impressive that so many different people are able to communicate so many different ways. And then you could argue that that's because they have a common mission, right? So then, right, I I just want you to follow my thought on this common mission. It's coming together for me. Exactly, right? So you have, I can see in your face what's coming together. Like you have a common mission. Sure. And if you, as an individual who's involved in the pursuit of the common mission, in this case rescuing that pilot, put aside your own conflict of interest, whatever that might be, right? Right. And you just focus on the mission. I think you can diminish, not eliminate, but you can certainly diminish.

Peter Dyga 13:59

I don't know if this is where you're going or if this is appropriate, but and and uh talking about putting aside conflicts of interest, boy, uh surviving and living is a pretty personal interest. You know, that a lot of people in order to rescue him had to put aside that that conflict of interest. Right? So how do how do military people do that? I guess maybe being court-martialed or going to jail is part of it. I don't know. So any event, is that that kind of like you know?

Sonny Maken 14:25

That's where I was taking business.

Peter Dyga 14:26

Right, yeah, but most organizations don't have that luxury. Right.

Sonny Maken 14:29

Exactly.

Peter Dyga 14:30

So, and I'm sure, you know, um whether people realize it or not, there's there's an underlying purpose in our conversation, oftentimes, even when it's about current affairs. So much uh translates or applies into our work lives and oftentimes our personal lives and our professional lives, and even at the as an association. Yeah. So so you know, and I think that's kind of you know how are you how are you hoping to tie all this in?

Sonny Maken 15:00

To remind people that one of the best ways you can communicate effectively is by putting together a team where you all focus on just the mission, right? And how important that is. And how inspected the measurements, exactly.

Peter Dyga 15:13

Because if you can there's a certain Because you've done a good job of showing that when it comes to, say, the military. You know, and in specific, we had a recent example. Yeah, yeah. So And that's your point, isn't it? That's my whole point. If you get away from the mission, um, like that communication and that completely falls apart.

Sonny Maken 15:31

Yeah, completely falls apart. Yeah. Because then nobody's focused on the mission, everybody's kind of focused on their own sort of pet interest or pet peeve or pet whatever you want to call it. And it's just then you talk past each other, and then it's like the pursuit of the mission falls apart. But then, and this is how Trump is related, any recognition of success falls apart. Because you can't even agree on the oh if you're not pursuing the mission, you can't agree on what success looks like. If you can't agree on that, any recognition of that just goes by the wayside because you're so um invested in your perspective being the one that everybody ought to follow as opposed to what the mission is. Because if you individually pursue anything, you're gonna fail, right? The whole idea, and I hate saying the word collective, but the whole idea of our existence as an association is that we all come together and pursue a common mission. Right. And the minute you step away from the mission, that's how miscommunication starts. And that's my whole point of this episode is What is that mission?

Peter Dyga 16:38

To help our members win work and deliver that work profitably, safely, and ethically. And ethically. Right. So everything we do, we like to think. And of course, the reason we have annual planning conferences and volunteer leaders that help us keep us accountable to the mission that they set is to make sure that we're holding true to that. And we would argue, and again, we have to assess this all the time, but everything we do, whether it's being the single largest provider of apprenticeship education and workforce development, or having an uh episode. Correct. You know, or uh the tremendous amount of investment that we do in terms of government affairs, yeah. You know, all this is towards that end of helping our members, you know, win work and deliver it safely, ethically, and profitably. Yeah.

Sonny Maken 17:22

So that's why that's literally why we exist, right? Right. And so everything, every single thing we do, uh, that's why we're a publisher, that's why we're a landlord, that's why we are an event planner, that's why we have a podcast, that's why we have a communications department, that's why we have all these elements come together to serve that mission.

Peter Dyga 17:43

Right.

Sonny Maken 17:44

And if any time you wander away from that, you're gonna have problems. Right. And you're gonna have to.

Peter Dyga 17:49

And there are some people that recognize that uh more clearly and and some that don't, you know. And um there are a lot of different organizations that do one aspect of what we do well, um, not necessarily the others. And I guess that's sometimes where things fall apart in terms of communication, is that um some of these things sometimes are nuanced, right? Um things are more obvious and upfront, other things are took a little development or thinking in order to get there. You know, like did we want to become that largest workforce development organization in the industry? You know, both reaching out to entry-level people and new people who decide to commit their lives to the industry and being a professional in the industry, uh, as well as developing people that are already there, making sure they're the very best talented people in the industry. You know, some people could argue you know, a lot of the steps along the way to get there, people might have not seen so clearly. Right. You know, so and that's gets back to the whole full circle in terms of communication. Exactly. I think.

Sonny Maken 18:48

But your mission wasn't even to be the largest. Your mission was to grow the construction industry, right? So success in the members addressed the problem that they were facing, you know, as it is today. Aaron Ross Powell, Jr. And to success in that has what's led us to be able to say we're the largest in the state of Florida, not because we were like, let's go be the largest in the state of Florida, let's just solve a problem for our members. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

Peter Dyga 19:09

But to your point, if they if you lose sight of that mission, the overall mission, and not just one aspect of it, um, you know, you're gonna you're gonna potentially have a a problem um recognizing uh the various steps along the way and the various efforts and the overall um value, if you will, of the organization and what it's doing.

Sonny Maken 19:30

So the last thing I'll say on this, because we we're out of time, believe it or not, is that whatever your mission is, whatever your organization is, whatever uh work you pursue, make sure everybody is coalesced around the same mission. And I think once you do that, it's gonna make the challenge of communication a lot easier because if you're all pursuing the same goal together, uh it's gonna be way more effective.

Peter Dyga 19:52

That also helps avoid the conflicts of interest. 100% when you're unified around that manager. Absolutely.

Sonny Maken 19:57

Well, thank you for joining us and listening and honoring us with your time. We will see you next Friday with another great episode.

Peter Dyga 20:03

All right. And for comments, send us an email at the obvious at abceflorida.com. Until next time. Thanks for listening. Ciao. Take care.